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Sup dudes and she dudes. I was running through pop goes the weasel with ny friend the other day and actually listened to the headsets. The last one before you get to the roof is extremely important. It says that the execution was carried out on 1944. To be more exact Ferguson says following the murder, the execution was carried out swiftly the next day on (month, day)1944. I'm sure the actual date is important but the fact that they were dead AFTER 1944 suggests that the map it self is older than everyone thinks.

Now of course being a theorist I have a few ideas how this contradiction still fits in. Fireworks around the island suggest that the city outside of Alcatraz is going on normally as they are celebrating new years or 4th of july. It could be safe to say that since the crew first arrived at Alcatraz in the 30's that the appearance of the outside world, their intended destination through the escape plan, would remain the same way they imagined it while the prison became over run with the undead and candles. lol.

In my opinion this is why the golden gate bridge is unfinished yet the prison gives a sense of antiquity. The bars have rusted, traps have been devised and built, the crew constantly references the infinite loop, its safe to say it could've been going on for 50 years or more. Or less. But at least 10.

Some proof to back up my theory is simple yet powerful;the clothing. Our Mafia crew have the updated 1940's version of the uniform;demin shirt and khakis. The undead have old school prison stripes and chains. If everything was set in 1930's the crew would be wearing the stripes.

Another over stated hint are the weapons. Deathmachine, lsat,pdw,raygun,...they all come from an entirely different era. Then we have the blundergat which comes from the past.I think with all of these factors its safe to say that the map itself exists OUTSIDE of time.

[[i have bad hearing apparently , Ferguson said 1934 but in the very least some interesting theories and things to think about were birthed through my terrible senses. Lol.]

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No, I think it occurs on December 31st, 1933 because that was when the escape took place, but since it failed, they couldn't leave the prison. Ever since all of their deaths, they are in the afterlife where they all relive the escape night over and over again, which is why sometimes they say stuff as of like either they have done this already, they know what this is for or this seems familiar. So each time they die during the zombie apocalypse on Alcatraz they are revived to start the escape night over again, which means that the cycle continues on the same night, December 31st, 1933. And the fireworks, I think that is because the people of San Francisco are celebrating New Years Eve/News Year Day (which would sadly never come for the 4 mobsters). So basically, the 4 mobsters can never escape the day of their escape (which is, once again, December 31st, 1933) ever as the cycle continues unless Arthur Arlington goes and "breaks the cycle" (a.k.a. Pop goes the Weasel). And the weapons, even though they are from different timelines (M1911 - Current, Ray Gun - WW2, MP5 - 60's, Five-Seven - Modern, PDW-57 - 2025), I don't think this helps to prove as that MotD happened at another time after the 1930's as the other maps on Black Ops 2 had weapons not from the timeline (TranZit and Die Rise had weapons from the Modern era and 2025 era, which would most likely be impossible for them to be created if Richtofen's Grand Scheme was accomplished). But then again, this is just my theory/opinion.

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Interesting that it is the concensus of everyone that the box is not canon. I humbly disagree , simply because of the infinite loop theory. If we can agree that there IS an infinite loop, we can agree time does not matter meaning the guns in the box are giving a HUGE clue as to what the zombie 'host' knows, what time period they are possibly from, and the extent of their omnipotence. The host or zombie controller(controller being used very lightly) Is assumed to be a god like omnipotent being that lives outside of normal time is it a stretch to believe that Sam,richtofen, or the original inhabitant simply wait and watch and add new weapons as they find them.through time?

Look at waw for example and compare the box to the black ops versions of the zombie maps. There was a reason treyarch re-released them with mule kick and new box weapons and I think it was to illustrate the passing of time where the host tried new weapons to aid the crew in spilling more 115 tainted blood. :)

I am however glad that you enjoyed the information, thanks for reading!

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Though I agree that the map exists (as you say) "outside of time", there are too many contradictions to pinpoint an exact date.

What you said at the start about being after 1944 I don't believe to be correct. Here are Ferguson's Audio transcripts taken from Tac's thread found HERE

Stanley Ferguson: My name is Stanley Ferguson, I was a guard at Alcatraz from 1933 to 1942. Today, I'm going to give you some insight into one of the more interesting tales of the prisons history. Over the decades, Alcatraz has seen more than its fair share of daring escape attempts. However, few were as audacious as the one undertaken by four inmates, on New Years Eve, 1933. Thought to be the brainchild of an inmate by the name of Albert Arlington, the outrageous scheme was as unlikely as its mastermind. 

It's believed that Arlington, aka The Weasel, somehow convinced three other inmates that he had devised a fool-proof plan to escape "The Rock." It was a plan that would seek, literally, taking to the skies on a makeshift aircraft of Arlington's own design.

Just how the Weasel managed to convince these hardened criminals that such a plan was even possible, remains a mystery to this day. What is known, is that no such plane was ever built. Instead, the groups plans for freedom soon descended into bitter argument, and infighting.

With the plan falling apart, anger and frustration would ultimately lead to a brutal altercation between the misguided Arlington and his former co-conspirators. Armed only with makeshift weapons, Finn O'Leary, Sal Deluca, and Billy Handsome, lured the unsuspecting Arlington to the roof, where they intended to exact a bloody and violent revenge. 

And so it was here, beneath the dark and stormy winter skies, that the hapless Arlington met his grizzly end, bleeding to death, on the cold, concrete roof. For their participation in the murder, the three collaborators were set to death by Electric Chair. Justice came swiftly. On the morning of January 19, 1934, the execution order was carried out.

In the Cafeteria there is also the menu board that has the date January 1, 1934. This was the day after the "Real life" Murder of Weasel.

Also worth noting, is that Ferguson says that he was a guard from 1933, so in the opening cutscene, he can not be that guard, as he wasn't even at Alcatraz when the 3 killed Weasel.

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The one critical element you are over looking is that the escape never took place. They were caught.afterwards billy,Sal,and fin. Killed weasel on the roof after luring him up there. After ward's ,in 1944, the three mobsters were executed. Listen to the headsets when you do the pop goes the weasel egg and you'll hear everything clearly. Time outside of the prison SEEMS exactly the way they REMEMBERED it but since they are in limbo they will never reach it since they are confined to the infinte loop to reflect on their wrong doings..just listen to the quotes when a character is down in multiplayer with no afterlife..they sincerely regret a lot in their lives and try to rationalize death..

No, I think it occurs on December 31st, 1933 because that was when the escape took place, but since it failed, they couldn't leave the prison. Ever since all of their deaths, they are in the afterlife where they all relive the escape night over and over again, which is why sometimes they say stuff as of like either they have done this already, they know what this is for or this seems familiar. So each time they die during the zombie apocalypse on Alcatraz they are revived to start the escape night over again, which means that the cycle continues on the same night, December 31st, 1933. And the fireworks, I think that is because the people of San Francisco are celebrating New Years Eve/News Year Day (which would sadly never come for the 4 mobsters). So basically, the 4 mobsters can never escape the day of their escape (which is, once again, December 31st, 1933) ever as the cycle continues unless Arthur Arlington goes and "breaks the cycle" (a.k.a. Pop goes the Weasel). And the weapons, even though they are from different timelines (M1911 - Current, Ray Gun - WW2, MP5 - 60's, Five-Seven - Modern, PDW-57 - 2025), I don't think this helps to prove as that MotD happened at another time after the 1930's as the other maps on Black Ops 2 had weapons not from the timeline (TranZit and Die Rise had weapons from the Modern era and 2025 era, which would most likely be impossible for them to be created if Richtofen's Grand Scheme was accomplished). But then again, this is just my theory/opinion.
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Oh damn. I could've sworn I heard 1944! I'm going to double check the theater..feel like an idiot now. lol

Though I agree that the map exists (as you say) "outside of time", there are too many contradictions to pinpoint an exact date.

What you said at the start about being after 1944 I don't believe to be correct. Here are Ferguson's Audio transcripts taken from Tac's thread found HERE

Stanley Ferguson: My name is Stanley Ferguson, I was a guard at Alcatraz from 1933 to 1942. Today, I'm going to give you some insight into one of the more interesting tales of the prisons history. Over the decades, Alcatraz has seen more than its fair share of daring escape attempts. However, few were as audacious as the one undertaken by four inmates, on New Years Eve, 1933. Thought to be the brainchild of an inmate by the name of Albert Arlington, the outrageous scheme was as unlikely as its mastermind. 

It's believed that Arlington, aka The Weasel, somehow convinced three other inmates that he had devised a fool-proof plan to escape "The Rock." It was a plan that would seek, literally, taking to the skies on a makeshift aircraft of Arlington's own design.

Just how the Weasel managed to convince these hardened criminals that such a plan was even possible, remains a mystery to this day. What is known, is that no such plane was ever built. Instead, the groups plans for freedom soon descended into bitter argument, and infighting.

With the plan falling apart, anger and frustration would ultimately lead to a brutal altercation between the misguided Arlington and his former co-conspirators. Armed only with makeshift weapons, Finn O'Leary, Sal Deluca, and Billy Handsome, lured the unsuspecting Arlington to the roof, where they intended to exact a bloody and violent revenge. 

And so it was here, beneath the dark and stormy winter skies, that the hapless Arlington met his grizzly end, bleeding to death, on the cold, concrete roof. For their participation in the murder, the three collaborators were set to death by Electric Chair. Justice came swiftly. On the morning of January 19, 1934, the execution order was carried out.

In the Cafeteria there is also the menu board that has the date January 1, 1934. This was the day after the "Real life" Murder of Weasel.

Also worth noting, is that Ferguson says that he was a guard from 1933, so in the opening cutscene, he can not be that guard, as he wasn't even at Alcatraz when the 3 killed Weasel.

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The audio clips of Stanley Ferguson telling the story of what originally happened to the mobsters that night state that it was New Year's Eve 1933. The three killed Weasel on the roof on New Years Eve of 1933, and were executed 19 days later on January 19, 1934.

But it really doesn't help pinpoint a date for the map, and I doubt we'll ever find one. Thus far, we have audio clips from Ferguson that say January 1934, a sign in the cafeteria on the map that says 1932, a bridge that has a construction date of 1936, and a water tower dating to 1941. The dates won't add up, in my opinion.

But I agree with the very last part of your post, the map exists outside the realm of time.

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I suppose I was just too on edge to hear correctly since I did the egg at 30 something lol you mentioned feguson not being the same guard from the cutscene yet Sal clearly adresses him as Ferguson in the beginning of the scene. Am I imagining this or is can you be mistaken? I didn't know about the water tower that is very interesting it really seems like there are different time zones surrounding the prison itself.

Though I agree that the map exists (as you say) "outside of time", there are too many contradictions to pinpoint an exact date.

What you said at the start about being after 1944 I don't believe to be correct. Here are Ferguson's Audio transcripts taken from Tac's thread found HERE

Stanley Ferguson: My name is Stanley Ferguson, I was a guard at Alcatraz from 1933 to 1942. Today, I'm going to give you some insight into one of the more interesting tales of the prisons history. Over the decades, Alcatraz has seen more than its fair share of daring escape attempts. However, few were as audacious as the one undertaken by four inmates, on New Years Eve, 1933. Thought to be the brainchild of an inmate by the name of Albert Arlington, the outrageous scheme was as unlikely as its mastermind.

It's believed that Arlington, aka The Weasel, somehow convinced three other inmates that he had devised a fool-proof plan to escape "The Rock." It was a plan that would seek, literally, taking to the skies on a makeshift aircraft of Arlington's own design.

Just how the Weasel managed to convince these hardened criminals that such a plan was even possible, remains a mystery to this day. What is known, is that no such plane was ever built. Instead, the groups plans for freedom soon descended into bitter argument, and infighting.

With the plan falling apart, anger and frustration would ultimately lead to a brutal altercation between the misguided Arlington and his former co-conspirators. Armed only with makeshift weapons, Finn O'Leary, Sal Deluca, and Billy Handsome, lured the unsuspecting Arlington to the roof, where they intended to exact a bloody and violent revenge.

And so it was here, beneath the dark and stormy winter skies, that the hapless Arlington met his grizzly end, bleeding to death, on the cold, concrete roof. For their participation in the murder, the three collaborators were set to death by Electric Chair. Justice came swiftly. On the morning of January 19, 1934, the execution order was carried out.

In the Cafeteria there is also the menu board that has the date January 1, 1934. This was the day after the "Real life" Murder of Weasel.

Also worth noting, is that Ferguson says that he was a guard from 1933, so in the opening cutscene, he can not be that guard, as he wasn't even at Alcatraz when the 3 killed Weasel.

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Don't feel like an idiot. There's too many dates & contradictions going on. :lol:

The one critical element you are over looking is that the escape never took place. They were caught.afterwards billy,Sal,and fin. Killed weasel on the roof after luring him up there

What you said about the escape never taking place is why I believe we hear the bell sound. I believe that we hear this sound (possibly) because of the rift & this has something to do with "Die Glock" (The Bell), the Teleporters may have caused this rift to begin with?

We hear a bell sound, we are hearing "The Bell", we are hearing "Die Glock"

Edit -

you mentioned feguson not being the same guard from the cutscene yet Sal clearly adresses him as Ferguson in the beginning of the scene. Am I imagining this or is can you be mistaken?

Haha sorry, I was thinking it was 1932. Too many damn dates. Hahaha

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