man-freshener-115

4. If anything is overpowered on this game, it's not the AR's, it's the AK74-U, an SMG. It fires smaller rounds than most of the AR's (5.45mm) but takes the same amount of hits as a larger calibre weapon like the Galil (7.62mm).

DeckchairsFTW

so like...the AR fires a 5.56. so does the Galil, Aug. Famas. and a number of other weapons in the game. the only 7.62 guns i know for sure in BO are the FAL. M14. HK21 and PSG1. besides the ak47 and RPK which fire the russian 7.62

the AR? Theres about 10...

The Galil fires 7.62's aswell.

So does the RPK, M60, HK21, AK47. The AK and RPK can fire several different sized rounds, depending on where/when it was made. The usual AK fires 7.62x.39 rounds, but many depending on where they were made can fire 7.62x51/ NATO rounds.

Yes the MP5k can kill in 3 shots, the same as the 74-U which is overpowered, but you are far less likely to hit a target with the MP5K at a distance than you are with the 74-U.

For a start, the MP5K seems to spray rounds in an inacurate way, and the recoil is circular, which is much harder to control than the AK74-u's recoil where it is simply raising the rifle. The 74-U also seems to be more accurate.

However, use of both these weapons i've used as an example are used by people based on personal preference, i for one can use both quite well.

DeckchairsFTW

On top of that, they gave the 74u a grenade launcher. I know in real life it can hold one, but come on. THAT's one reason that it's overpowered.

[\quote]

4. If anything is overpowered on this game, it's not the AR's, it's the AK74-U, an SMG. It fires smaller rounds than most of the AR's (5.45mm) but takes the same amount of hits as a larger calibre weapon like the Galil (7.62mm).

I hope this clears up some issues you may have.

DeckchairsFTW

Then shouldn't you consider the MP5k overpowered then? It takes three hits to kill, same as the 74u.

And, I'm saying this again, the assault rifles are in fact overpowered.

I know I have. The new ones don't have that "zombies" feel to me like in W@W. In W@W, it feels raw and creepy. I don't get that feeling in Black Ops. In Black Ops, it's feels like they put too much into the maps. Like the monkeys, crawlers, Romero, and it doesn't feel neat. It just feels annoying.

The older ones were much simpler and thought out. Sure, they put in some news things but not to the point where it got annoying. Like Der Riese. The map is just the right size. Not too big where it's hard to get to teammates, but not too small to where you're always surrounded by zombies. Plus, how many think that the Pack A Punch weapons look cooler in WAW Der Riese than in Black Ops? To me, the black ops ones look too digital, whereas the Der Riese ones look like something the Greek gods made.

who can forget "EIN, ZWEI, DIEEE!" from verruckt?

i used to love that phrase

SCREW YOU, MAGGOTFACE!

Of course smg's dominated in WAW, they were the only fully automatic weapon on the game apart from the Father of all modern assault rifles, the STG44.

Honestly, what would you rather take into battle? A Springfield or a Thompson?

*cough* MP40 with Juggernaut *cough*

But I did see people use the bolt action and semi automatics fairly often. Even without the scopes I saw people use the quite frequently. Not as often as SMG's, but enough to notice. I actually didn't use the SMG's that much and stuck to the semi autos and bolt actions. Don't know why. Just preferred them that way.

Well, one of the Marines is Dempsey. He was sent in to recover the double agent Peter because his identity was feared compromised.

M2 Flamethrower was one of greatest weapons in the box in WaW it was the best for covering windows and useful in instant kill and last resort, although they could have made you move faster with but it was still awesome. I would love the FG-42 back then it was the greatest wall gun in its time and when pap + double tap 'finger of God'. I hope it comes back and the chances of that are slim but you never know

Love the FG42. It's the first gun that I get. I don't know why people don't buy it more often.

Idk man in WaW subs tore asshole.

Lol that's what i was thinking...even IF you took out the MP40, the SMG's were still the obviously dominant weapon in WaW, though much less so than the AR's are now...while i do agree with the points above, the FAMAS and AUG can spray in close quarters just as well as an SMG can...i know from experience

The Panda's out...

That's my point. Assault rifles should not be able to compete with SMG's in close quarters. But then you have guns like the Famas or AUG. It's an SMG with long range capabilities, so then what's the point in using an SMG? Do you really want to sacrifice long range capability? I don't think so.

And in W@W, the subs did dominate but at least I saw people use the bolt actions and the semi automatic rifles. At least people DID use a little bit of everything.

I'll just start off by saying moaning won't help, but hey, what are forums for?

There are several good reasons why SMG's aren't as effective in ordinary hands as AR's.

1. SMG's are supposed to be fast firing, CQB weapons, they fire smaller rounds than their AR bigger brothers, which pose as much of an immediate threat to the enemy as an AR does, but only in a small space. e.g. there's no point trying to kill someone 300 metres away with an SMG because you simply won't hit them, or if you do, the Velocity of the round has decreased so much that it simply causes a smaller injury.

2. As for ammo, SMG's are meant for short, small battles in a small area. Just think of the SAS, and other counter terrorism units, they use MP5's, UMP's etc for their lightness, mobility, and ability to pack a punch in a small space. Storming a building won't use much ammo unless it's a whacking great skyscraper. Assault rifles are meant for long battles that could last days, thus the need for more ammo. Snipers are meant to have one shot kills most of the time, that's why they carry less too.

3. Muzzle flash. Often, SMG's do not have a sufficiently long barrel to facilitate a flash hider, flash eliminator etc. Without making the barrel longer, they simply cannot have one on there, as you need a good 4 inches to fit one on. AR's do have sufficient barrel length for this.

4. If anything is overpowered on this game, it's not the AR's, it's the AK74-U, an SMG. It fires smaller rounds than most of the AR's (5.45mm) but takes the same amount of hits as a larger calibre weapon like the Galil (7.62mm).

I hope this clears up some issues you may have.

DeckchairsFTW

I'm not disagreeing with this post, because, yes that's what they are for. But the problem is this is a video game. Call of Duty is not about realism, it's about having fun. And having fun means gun balance. But trying to use guns like the Uzi or PM63, and you'll find yourself at a severe disadvantage. Not just because of the range of which they are severely limited to.

For some of the SMG's, you are forced to use certain perks in order to make it work for you, like I said in the first post. For instance, the Skorpion and Mac11 are both guns that need Scavenger because they come with a short magazine capacity and low reserve capacity. But the AK74u and most of the Assault rifles offer dual magazines, which completely eliminate the need for Scavenger on longer streaks (and sometimes means you don't need sleight of hand) so you can use Flak Jacket or Hardline. But then try using those perks on a regular Skorpion, and you may do good for a little bit, but guess what happens? You run out ammo!

Plus, I don't understand why they get stuck with less ammo considering that it's a weaker gun, even at close range. Remember, this isn't about realism. I'll play Battlefield if I want that.

And if you think I'm crazy, just play Black Ops and make a mental note to watch the killfeed and just count how many assault rifle kills there are compared to submachine gun kills and I guarantee you that assault rifles with outnumber the SMG kills.

Or do this. Next time that you play, use the AUG or Famas with dual mags and steady aim, and tell me that that isn't as effective as an SMG up close.

Funny, in WaW all SMG's were amazing, and now they've been replaced by assault rifles, but they don't all really suck, but they aren't fantastic.

Actually, the Uzi really sucks. :roll:

I just don't understand it. How could Treyarch have gone into making this game without realizing the dangers of the Famas, AUG, or Galil? Not only that, but the subs suck in their own right anyway.

I should be able to use whatever gun that I want and still be able to compete with it, right? Let's take a look at some major balance issues.

Let's say I wanted to use a Mac11. Why? Fastest reload when not reload canceling and fast swap speed.

Now enter the Famas. There's no reason to use a Mac11 over a Famas. Why? Because both have the same rate of fire, but the Famas has three shot kill at close range and four at long range while the Mac11 is a four shot kill close range and five shot kill long range, on top off having less attachments. Where is the balance?

Also, the Kiparis. This...gun...sucks.

Treyarch: Oh, well, it has assault rifle penetration.

Me: Enter the Enfield. This has assault rifle penetration, more attachments, and the ADS of an SMG. Where's the balance?

Also, with guns like the Mac11, Skorpion, etc. you are forced to use Scavenger to avoid running out ammunition. But Assault rifles get dual mags so you don't need Scavenger. I don't understand the "balance" there considering the Skorpion or Mac11 are weaker guns at long range and have low starting ammo.

Also, one thing I noticed. The submachine guns seem to be the only guns that have muzzle flash. With guns like the Famas, you'd think you'd be blinded by the ridiculous ROF it has. But no, the poor submachine guns, as usual, are just completely defeated by All powerful Assault rifles.

I swear, COD4 is the only COD so far where nothing is overpowered.

nice, i was about to make a topic about this.

I chose the M60, AK47, M2, Uzi, and KS-23.

The KS-23 because I think shotguns are underrated in this game. If you consider how many kills a shotgun can make compared to an assault rifle, it's not much (The Stakeout being an exception). So I say add the KS-23 to balance out the semi-auto to pump-action shotgun ratio.

The Uzi, I think, should replace the PM-63.

The M2 (with ammo) because it was a pretty unique weapon in a box full of lead-based ones, and it was just fun to use.

The AK-47 because of how iconic it is, but have another assault rifle be replaced.

The M60 because it's just...badass?

All good choices [brains]

LOL at the last one.

Though I disagree with the flamethrower having ammo. A lot players disliked it because it was slow and took a long time to kill, but it appealed to a few here and there because it never ran out of "ammo" and you could get lots of points with it. But making it have ammo would ruin it for a lot and make it useless.

Ever since Verruckt, the PPSH-41 was always my favorite weapon for zombies. I voted for the M60, MG42, PPSH-41.

And it's not like having the PPSh-41 wouldn't make sense. The Viet Cong were still using them in the Vietnam War.

What would you like to see in Shangri-la?

I put in the Sawed-Off Dual Wield Double Barrel because I felt players got ripped off by the Call of The Dead Trailer.

I'll post the most popular choices the day before Shangri-La drops.

Hey guys. Sorry I didn't post the most wanted weapons, got kinda lazy. :|

And anyway, they didn't include any of the weapons you guys wanted which really sucks. :cry:

I would really like the M60 in zombies,but i doubt that it'll ever be implented.

It was in the Wii version, wasn't it?

Here you go Dykes:

biRQC5Gc44

Read my 'How to use BBCode' in my sig, it'll help you with stuff like that.

Also, apparently putting other guns in the box takes up more space, as well as upsetting the balance of power in guns.

For instance with the Stoner63, that is yet another high powered LMG, so you'd need a low powered one to counterbalance it. And Uzis, Kparis's and things like that are very fast firing SMG's with a decent punch, which runs into the same problem.

And yeah, the 1887 was an IW game, thus the coding being theirs. So Treyarch would have to write their own for one Gun that just doesn't really fit in with the storyline (M1887)

Since when is gun balance an issue in zombies? And do the guns really need to fit in? It's about having fun, and using the same old guns over and over gets boring.

I wish they would put in guns like the Model 1887's and the KS-23, the Kiparis, and the Uzi in the zombies mode. I don't want just new Wonder Weapons, I want to be able to use other guns than the mystery box and off the wall guns. And it's not like they couldn't either.

Models are in MW2 lol, or do you mean make a gun like it?

The Models were in Black Ops campaign. The motorcycle escape from Vorkuta, you used a single one. And it's in the game files so I don't see why not. Dual wield 1887's in zombies sounds pretty sick.

I wish they would put in guns like the Model 1887's and the KS-23, the Kiparis, and the Uzi in the zombies mode. I don't want just new Wonder Weapons, I want to be able to use other guns than the mystery box and off the wall guns. And it's not like they couldn't either.

Ok, I don't know if I'm the only one who has noticed this because I don't see anybody else talking about it, but I have noticed that in the downstairs room with the MPL, if you look up at the balcony on the MPL side, you can see four blacked out portraits like the ones of Richtofen, Dempsey, Takeo and Nikolai, hanging on the wall.

You can see them better if you go to the upstairs barricade when there are no boards hanging and you can see them clearly.

I don't know what they are supposed to mean, but maybe they are supposed to be JFK's team.

nice finding and if u look outside window next to m14 there is another 4 u might hav found that already

No, I didn't find that. Where do you look to find them?

So for the last 5 maps......you haven't bought into ANYTHING with the lyrics meaning something.....If you think that Beauty of Annihilation or 115 have a meaning and this doesn't then idk.

On the side with less attitude from me, do you think that the lyrics seem similar just out of coincidence.

Aaaaaaaaahhhhhhh......... 'Tis you! The one who stole the credit of finding the DerRiese server from me. I say this because you did NOT give me credit for finding it first, although I did. Well, anyways, moving on. I did NOT say that tge songs gave NO meaning, I said we do not know wgat they mean, because we do not know whose eyes tgese songs are written through. I am saying that his "Analysis" is probably wrong, because he just randomly threw Richtofen in there. It does not mention Richtofen ANYWHERE, AT ALL, IN ANY WAY. So the fact that he just said, for no reason, that Richtofen is who she is speaking of (With no evidence that that is who she is apeaking of) is annoying. It's like me saying, "Oh, yeah, in 115 she is totally saying that she has a crush on Tank, and she nicknamed him "115". And she is also saying that Richtofen is helping Takeo hold onto his life, and that Nikolai is lossely Christian." It makes no sense, because no evidence is there to support it. That is what I am saying.

Why could it NOT be Richtofen, though? It seems everywhere I go people say it could be Sam and her evil side, Yuri the scientist, or even the players POV, but say that it could in no way be Richtofen. Was he not the one who

1. Made the Wunderwaffe DG-2 and the monkey bomb

2. Worked for the Illuminati, who want to rule the world

3. Aided in the creation of the zombies

4. Killed Samantha and Dr. Maxis

Do you understand what I'm saying? Richtofen's role in the Nazi Zombies storyline is pretty freaking huge. And this whole journey that the four characters are on is basically all Richtofen's doing. This battle between the zombies and the characters revolves around Richtofen and Sam. Richtofen is basically using the other three to fight his battle for him. In other words, Richtofen has quite a load on his conscience right now.

If indeed it is Richtofen (which I think is the best possibility) it's a good step for the storyline because it really develops Richtofen's character. The players POV makes no sense (was that not already in Beauty of Annihilation, which it was their POV), Yuri's POV also doesn't factor in considering how small of a role he had, and Sam good vs Sam bad just doesn't make sense either, because the lyrics don't make sense with a good Sam and a bad Sam. They aren't the same because one would want the survivors to avenge her and stop the zombies, while the other side wants them to die. We know she wants revenge against Richtofen and we know that in Richtofen's mind he needs to stop the zombies and stop Sam.

If you look at that with no regard for the lyrics to Abracadavre, they ARE indeed the same. Forced to kill each other.

The songs interpretations are entirely up to us to find out their meaning. But some are just plain obvious, while others you actually need to analyze and do a little digging. You can't just expect them so explicitly say who's character POV it is.

Lullaby for a Dead Man - This is most likely from Sam's POV. I know that Sam wasn't discovered till Der Riese, but Treyarch is the one that made the storyline and could have had the whole thing planned out right after Nacht Der Untoten became so popular. Also, the singer says "Father, you know how long it's taken me, I live again." Sam lives again.

The One - obviously from the zombies perspective. There's just no one else it could be.

Beauty of Annihilation - The character's POV and the zombies. It's stated in the first few lines, each line being a description of one of the characters, while the screaming parts are the zombies, so it seems to be a struggle between the characters and the zombies.

115 - Samantha's. Come on, the first lyrics are "No one can see me and I've lost all feeling." and "I've lost all form and unity". Sam is likely not a ghost but pure energy, as in the radio on Der Riese, you can hear a teleporter in the background, so her matter form is gone but her energy is still lingering. "I'll stop you from breathing and all your deceiving." Sam is talking about Richtofen, how he betrayed Sam and Dr. Maxis, and the fact that he's hiding his past from the other three.

Won't Back Down - don't really count it, but if I were to guess, JFK's

Abracadavre - already argued

I know this came in late, but better late than never.

I think "Five" is just to make JFK a bit more useful in Black Ops, as he is only seen once in Campaign. Some people don't even remember seeing him. I don't blame them. You don't have to press one button for the"mission".

Well, the entire campaign was really "Press X to win". They went over the top with the scripted moments. It felt like a museum rather than a game.

yeah, I think five is great! I also don't think it's that hard. I got 35 solo, and 41 with 3 people. You just need to keep moving, but don't sprint and you can survive on the bottom floor.

Yea, people just hate it because it has no good camping spot. And while you do run around in circles, you are very confined in how you do it.

I don't think Five sucks, I think its just easy to get discouraged because its hard and if thought you were sick at Zombies this map can humble you very easily.

I have no idea why you say this map is hard, its v easy, its just not challenging enough. Since it is small playing with randoms is pain in the *** unlike with other maps. If you are really saying this map is tough I can take any challenge, set me a number and I'll beat it co-op or solo.

BTW solo does not count dude so don't be happy with those solo numbers. show us what you got on co-op and prove it through leaderboards.

Five still sucks.

Five does not suck. I got bored of Ascension after a while so I tried Five. It's right now my favorite zombie map. The only reason it sucks is because it wasn't made right for multiple players. A lone gunman stands a much better chance on Five.

This map is lame! I totally agree with you everywhere is so narrow and it's hard to get beyond round 17 or 18, I got to 23 once with two people, you just get cornered all the time and even though it's in the Pentagon it's a bit boring...

But it has Fidel Castro.

And Castro's a legend

This is why the map is fun. Its purposefully difficult, you can't pick a single strategy and stick with it. Like everybody else, its my lowest-round map, but it is probably in my top 3 favorites (I have a hard time ranking them).

Its small, fast, and furious. You aren't going to be able to pick a mechanical strategy and run with it, which always makes things interesting. I don't have much of a problem getting past 20 on solo, but multiplayer it gets so intense so quickly. I wouldn't change a thing about it.

Also, this is the only zombie map where you really can't camp well, which is probably why a lot of people hate it.

My strategy is kind of difficult if you don't play "Five" a lot, but what I do is after about 3 rounds of using my pistol I go out and grab an MPL. Then I camp by the elevator until I have about 13000 points. Then I go downstairs, open the stairs barricade and the elevator barricade, then head downstairs and activate the power. After doing that, firstly I get Juggernog, then link up the DEFCON switches and Pack a Punch my M1911 pistol to get the Mustang and Sally's. This makes the thief rounds incredibly easy. After teleporting back to the War Room, I trade my MPL for an MP5k, then open up the two barricades downstairs. Then simply run around the war room in circles, building up a train of zombies and then shooting them with your MP5k, which racks up more points than shooting zombies individually.