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83457

That Fifth Solo Classic...

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83457    263

Anyone else find the fifth solo classic GG lacking? I can throw on a Mega, or make a classic mp pack (i never do though, in mp zombs i use a mix of both), but i find a few to be tied at "meh" for fifth place.

 

(No particular order)

 

1. Alchemical Antithesis. The fact that it gives ammo and is unlimited by being classic, makes it outshine even most Mega GG. Awesome.

 

2. Arsenal Accelerator. Bring back your powerful Sword/Ragnarok faster by half (depending on kills). A worthy pick.

 

3. In Plain Sight. Revives, perks after downs, or just to sneak out of a bad situation, this is a great GG.

 

4. Anywhere But Here!. At first it killed you often randomly, but since that went away, this has been useful. It gets you across the map as an escape, to cover ground getting to a revive, or to leave an area without paying. Not amazing, but worthy.

 

5. (Solo?) Here, I'm tied up with 4 options that are less than what we have above. 

 

5a. Armamental Accomplishment. I do stab, i do camp in lower rounds, so faster recovery and weapon swap is meh. This is my most common meh pick.

 

5b. Always Done Swiftly. Move faster while aiming and raising and lowering my gun faster is so meh. (Seeing this GG in someone's pack triggers my 'leave this noob lobby' nerve, even in solo. Ha). Probably tied for second with Stock Option.

 

5c. Danger Closest. "Every several rounds I can fire my Meat Wagon"! Yeah, that is crap, but it does actually ease the sting of 4-8 meatballs at once past like round 40 SoE. Very meh. Taking this GG inspires me to use Meat Wagon, which is fail mode.

 

5d. Stock Option. Great gum, if it ever was active when you want it,  but it only shows up when you hit the machine while doing necessary busywork, then is there for only 3 minutes. Fix it: Make it 10 minutes (still green) or make it for 2-3+ rounds (as blue GG), or make it user-activated for 3 minutes (as purple GG). So very meh as is.

 

That's it. Lucky Crit is shit, so that's out. Sword Flay is garbage for a few obvious reasons. The others are mp GG. 

 

I get that they are classic, but i wish we had a fifth at the same level as the first 4.

 

So what do you guys use? Am i missing some great classic GG functionality, or is there just 4 classic solo GG?

 

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Nieno69    126
3 hours ago, 83457 said:

Anyone else find the fifth solo classic GG lacking? I can throw on a Mega, or make a classic mp pack (i never do though, in mp zombs i use a mix of both), but i find a few to be tied at "meh" for fifth place.

 

(No particular order)

 

1. Alchemical Antithesis. The fact that it gives ammo and is unlimited by being classic, makes it outshine even most Mega GG. Awesome.

 

2. Arsenal Accelerator. Bring back your powerful Sword/Ragnarok faster by half (depending on kills). A worthy pick.

 

3. In Plain Sight. Revives, perks after downs, or just to sneak out of a bad situation, this is a great GG.

 

4. Anywhere But Here!. At first it killed you often randomly, but since that went away, this has been useful. It gets you across the map as an escape, to cover ground getting to a revive, or to leave an area without paying. Not amazing, but worthy.

 

5. (Solo?) Here, I'm tied up with 4 options that are less than what we have above. 

 

5a. Armamental Accomplishment. I do stab, i do camp in lower rounds, so faster recovery and weapon swap is meh. This is my most common meh pick.

 

5b. Always Done Swiftly. Move faster while aiming and raising and lowering my gun faster is so meh. (Seeing this GG in someone's pack triggers my 'leave this noob lobby' nerve, even in solo. Ha). Probably tied for second with Stock Option.

 

5c. Danger Closest. "Every several rounds I can fire my Meat Wagon"! Yeah, that is crap, but it does actually ease the sting of 4-8 meatballs at once past like round 40 SoE. Very meh. Taking this GG inspires me to use Meat Wagon, which is fail mode.

 

5d. Stock Option. Great gum, if it ever was active when you want it,  but it only shows up when you hit the machine while doing necessary busywork, then is there for only 3 minutes. Fix it: Make it 10 minutes (still green) or make it for 2-3+ rounds (as blue GG), or make it user-activated for 3 minutes (as purple GG). So very meh as is.

 

That's it. Lucky Crit is shit, so that's out. Sword Flay is garbage for a few obvious reasons. The others are mp GG. 

 

I get that they are classic, but i wish we had a fifth at the same level as the first 4.

 

So what do you guys use? Am i missing some great classic GG functionality, or is there just 4 classic solo GG?

 

What do you mean sword flay is garbage? Its the best gg after alchemical... in solo i only use the classic gg - alchemical and sword flay- i equip other three just to fill up like in plain sights and anywhere but here (for zns ee)... but i only use the first two 

 

Most of the gg are meh... but sword flay not at all...

 

 

Sword flay: you can play the first rounds and hit the machine every round till you get it - in three minutes you should get enough points to get all doors open and jug or get to the bowie and knife till round 10? The best gg for setup

After setup the only gg in use is alchemical 

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Rissole25    378

Lucky Crit is good if you routinely get Mule Kick, and 3 Re-Packed guns. That's the best way to get the maximum effectiveness out of it.

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Koslans    39

The only ones I ever used so far is 'Hide in Plain Sight' and 'Alchemical Antithesis'

'Anywhere But Here' might safe your life, but like you said, pre-patch it just killed you instead. 

I got in in the pack now, just for Zetsubou no Shima.

 

The other two I roll with are the 'Arms Grace' for when I'm drunk.

And I still want to know whether we can have two bows for one. 

And 'Now You See Me' because I wanted to try it out. I haven't got around to it yet though. 

 

Most gumballs have their use, but in reality.....

I don't even use the gumball machine unless I'm bored in round 20-30 and hit it during a Firesale, just because I can. 

I did use it a lot when the game first came out, just for the novelty of things. 

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83457    263

Thanks for the replys, guys. Remember, I'm talking solo.

(I'm on 360, so SoE and DE so far).

------------

Nieno69. In solo SoE, I buy the Bowie Knife on round 1 or 2. So, clearly a Sword Flay strategy isn't my best option. Sure it's 500, not 3000, but I'd still rather have the Bowie Knife on round 1 or 2, rather than be spamming the GG machine. 

 

On DE, I'd rather get the 4 doors, and a VMP, (so hopefully I'll get bow started before dogs), rather than spend 500 points on a 1 in 5 chance at Sword Flay, but i will try this method there. I do appreciate you sharing the concept. I'm not sure I'll ever share your opinion of SF, but I'll try it. :)

 

I curse the players who spam the box and/or GG machine in MP DE, instead of buying doors at start, so I'm not about to try it in mp DE, but maybe in mp SoE...

-------------

Rissole25, I've done extensive testing and have seen literally zero difference between using lucky crit, and not using it (tests: mostly circling with BF and camping with Turned) everything procs at what seems like the same rate, the difference must be negligible. Maybe because I'm on old gen? Am i missing something? For a GG that lasts only 1+ round, I'd expect an obvious effect, as it is, i see no effect at all.

 

I know that you were simply pointing out the best way to use it, and i appreciate that. I'm also not a big MK user.

-------------

Koslans, i was talking solo.  Arm's grace won't help. Ha. You can't have 2 bows, even solo. You can make all 4, carry just 1.

 

Edit: Now You See Me is for mp, as they all come for you in solo anyway.

 

NYSM in MP: can pull zombies to your bow upgrade/ egg statue, et cetera. It can keep zombies away from a player reviving another. But it can also mess up people's trains as the zombies run away from them for 10 seconds, then double back, putting them in peril. Use carefully.

----------

Happy gaming. I'm willing to hear more arguments for these or others. Thanks. 

 

Edited by 83457
Now you see me feedback.

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DaveLo07    172

@83457 I have to agree with most of what you have said about the classic gobblegums on solo. The only ones I would use consistently are In Plain Sight and Alchemical Antithesis. If you're spinning the gobblegum machine multiple times mid round for Alchemical in high rounds, In Plain Sight is useful to have in rotation, as you can use it to keep hitting the machine without having to watch your back/run in circles.

 

Danger Closest is not that useful on solo, but I still enjoy using explosive pistols when paying casual games (Death and Taxes, Meat Wagon) and you can keep hitting for Danger Closest each round to ensure you have it most the time. I know this is a solo list, but if I play public on The Giant, Danger Closest is useful for clearing zombies to revive team mates.

 

It doesn't have to be a choice between the Bowie knife or Sword Flay. Although this useless on most maps because of the weaponry you will already have at this point, Sword Flay combined with the Bowie will allow you to 1 hit knife into the 20's and 2 hit I think til 31? Still quite useful on The Giant. But yeah, hitting for it in early rounds seems like an unnecessary gamble when points are important.

 

Also, I know this is a classic list, but am I the only person who uses Licensed Contractor as a way of narrowing down the options in solo? Means instead of losing 500 points, you gain 100 (more if you activate a double points drop first) and you can hit again the next round for whichever gobblegum you're trying to get without wasting your points. 

 

 

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Nieno69    126

@83457

How you actually buy the bowie on round 1 or 2 solo?  That needs a lot of effort and time 

 

But again its useful on the bowie too - its not spamming the gg machine -e.g. on der eisendrache you have points to spend in the beginning while you fill the dragon - or do you run to power and then go bsck to the first dragon?

 It doesnt really matter if you buy a gun or hit the gg machine

 

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83457    263
2 hours ago, Nieno69 said:

@83457

How you actually buy the bowie on round 1 or 2 solo?  That needs a lot of effort and time 

 

But again its useful on the bowie too - its not spamming the gg machine -e.g. on der eisendrache you have points to spend in the beginning while you fill the dragon - or do you run to power and then go bsck to the first dragon?

 It doesnt really matter if you buy a gun or hit the gg machine

 

SoE: By the time the third solo beast is done and i kill the zombies (open E Street, Nero's, WF first door), I usually get 3,000 (no x2) to 10,000 points (double x2s), depending on x2 drops (You need 4250 by this point to open the other door and get BK). I normally get about 38-45ish round 1 zombies using Beasts SoE functions.

--------------

DE: Round 1: I open 2 doors, I do the dragon on round 2 (there is exactly enough zombies on round 2) and buy the VMP to survive. By end of 3, hopefully the Shield is built and I'm filling Dragon 2, otherwise by round 4 end.

 

Then i need to get Juggernog (this was mandatory with the triple slaps, now it is not as necessary, yet still a good idea for solo) and fill dragon 3.

 

By then, Dogs may show up. I find the game too point-constrained to risk 500 for a 1 in 5 chance of a GG that will then be useless for the rest of the game.

 

Now, setting myself back 500 points for a spin of the GGm isn't horrible, but it's not good like you suggest. 

 

Doing the math: (correct math at bottom of post).

 

Even if i get SF early, it's 130 per stab (after -500 for GG, if I get it first try), as opposed to 100 per headshot without dropping 500 on a GG. (That's stabbing 17 zombies just to make up the extra 500 spent on SF, and that is if I got it on the first try).

 

So SF is pointless on round 1 and 2, as you can simply stab anyway.  

 

So SF round 3; the round 3 zombies might get me an extra 30 (or more) points each if I had SF (more if body shot kills them as opposed to headshots). SF will last 1 round at best with it's 1.5 minute timer. 

 

So, if you get Sword Flay, it is a basically a guaranteed loss of points, with the 500 point initial investment (even if you get it first try). That doesn't make sense to do.

 

It has, at best, a 20% chance to show up first try. Couple that with the Trollarch programming, and you have a near 100% that a first room GG buy will give 'ABH!' or 'Arsenal Accelerator', since they would be most useless. :) 

 

So, in a perfect storm, it MAY show up first try, it MAY make you slightly more points. High risk, low reward.

 

So, after thinking it through, your strategy is a 'stragedy', as i like to say.

 

MP lobby: And if you hit the GG machine before buying 1 of the first 4 doors, don't be surprised that good players leave the game right then.

 

Sword Flay is garbage. Play how you want and have fun, but this is not a good strategy to embrace.

 

Edit: actual numbers:

-------

Round 3, 13 solo zombies.

 

Headshot = 1,300 points.

Stab = 1,690 - initial 500 investment = 1,190 points.

 

That's a loss. Even if i miss a few headshots, which is unlikely at this level. It's more likely I'd get a couple of stab kills with my headshots for more points, not less.

-------

Round 4, 18 solo zombies.

 

Headshot = 1,800 points.

Stab = 2,340 - 500 = 1,840.

 

That's a 20% chance that you'll get 40 extra points. 

 

80% chance of spending 500 unecessarily.

-------

Happy gaming!

Edited by 83457
Mathing

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Nieno69    126

@83457 Yeah you have a point if you play like that you max your points 

 

To make that clear "Good players" never leave a game because someone buy a gg

 

Actually I'm the one buying doors in mp - you need to look what the other people do in your game and if i would leave every lobby because some people buy gg or spam the box in the first room i would never go above round 1 or 2

 

But back to solo: you only look after yourself and because of this you dont need to save rounds because you cannot get in trouble in the game if you know what you are doing

 

And you dont need to end the first dragon on round 2 -

 

I dont want to wait a minute till the last zombie comes to the dragon

 

Further i dont judge people and say they have a "stragedy"  - but it looks you invest every game a lot of time to setup - in my opinion a little to focused in points in the lower rounds for a soloplay

 

 

You asked for an opinion - sword fly is one of the best normal gg's 

 

You dont need to use it play how you want

 

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Koslans    39
17 hours ago, 83457 said:

Koslans, i was talking solo.  Arm's grace won't help. Ha. You can't have 2 bows, even solo. You can make all 4, carry just 1.

 

I Yeah, but I'm lazy and I'm not gonna swap them around every time I switch from solo to split-screen or back. 

I wondered if we can have two for one in a co-op game. Haven't tried it yet though. 

 

About the 5x melee damage gumball, how good it that WITH a bowie knife? 

Another thing I haven't even tried.

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83457    263

@Nieno69, I'm sorry i sound like an ass sometimes. I like your input and I'm glad that you posted. 

 

I do focus on points and set up (I'm only uptight until power is on), but in an actual game, I'm real easy going unless i am being trolled.

 

I tried it out (SF on DE). Even turns 4-5 and whatnot, SF is a slow way to feed dragons. Before that, it's losing points.

 

So, I still think Sword Flay is poo, but we both paid for our game and can find happiness as we choose. :)

 

Again, sorry for any snarkiness, it's built in to my programming. Picture me smiling like a jerk when i talk smack, and deal some back to me. It's all good.

-------------

Koslans, SF does work on the BK, i used to know to what level (23?).

 

Widow's Wine also effects your knife damage, but not your BK damage, from what i understand. 

 

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