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Guest Shoreyo

How the characters prevented Moon. (WARNING: VERY TECHNICAL)

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Guest Shoreyo   
Guest Shoreyo

This will be included in the comic I am writing as part of the epilogue, won't spoil it but it involves an outside person wondering how they could have survived moon, he theorises this.

viewtopic.php?f=25&t=19472&p=180122#p180122

Firstly, before you read.

This theory assumes that all of this took place in our past, and that therefore the Earth must have been prevented from being destroyed and prior to that, 935 research must have been witheld from Operation Paperclip/Ascension retrospectively (Otherwise JFK will die in the pentagon, the Earth will be destroyed etc)

So if this all took place, how come their 60s is different to ours?

The answer lies with Brock and Gary. Remeber them from Shangri La? A theory appeared earlier which explained, through science their paradox. found here: viewtopic.php?f=69&t=18227&hilit=+shangri

Special thanks to strange-bow7 who discussed with me through the topic to which we came to the conclusion.

Among other things, the thing we found was that the characters were able to change the past without major actions to the present. However you must understand that to change the present alters the future! Time is not a growing point travelling through space with us, while space and time are relevent time is seperate, by changing space you can alter time and visa versa, yet the future (i.e. 2020) to a man living beyond that date (i.e. 2030) is their past, therefore, as we all know, a view of time travel is that we can change the past, actually just appearing in the past can change it as we weren't there before!

Yet one aspect of this, the one we realised was related to Shangri La, was that history is change resistant in direct relationship to the importance of the event ie. small trivial events can be readily changed but large ones take great effort.

In laymans terms: By changing the past the characters saved Brock and Gary, but didn't effect the wider picture i.e. the Earth didn't turn into a lemon or Richtoffen ceased to exist!

However annother rule is the butterfly effect, the wings of a butterfly can cause a hurricane through the movements of the wind!

Oscilating universal theory is also needed, this states that everytime an action is made, every possible action creates an alternate universe, it makes sense, by going left instead of right you are in a different scenario to when going right!

Got all of that? Good, becuase that my friends, in the clincher of this theory, I'll go slowly to help you understand it, as it could be hard to grasp:

1. The 60s are our past, but they are the characters future (they live in the 40s remember)

2. By leaving the past they left Der Riese, Sam, and the research of 935.

3. As we all know, when the US and USSR liberated Europe they took scientists and research they found as a way to fight each other, ascension for example was the USSR's use of V2 rocket designers to put missiles in the air and men in space, likewise men in Nasa were nazi's who had been 'forgiven' for being so.

4. Therefore the USSR and US founmd 935 research, as Der Riese is Near Breslau, and Verruckt is in Berlin (as well as SNN being in Japan or simmilar pacific islands), we can assume the USSR reached Der Riese and the US salvaged Verruckt ( and possibly SNN) However the actual places each reached first do not matter (although it would explain why the US focused on the Ray gun and not the wunderwaffe yet this itself can be explained in other ways)

5. As we know, Five shows the US continued the research, making teleporters, continued research on the hybrids and the Winters Howl (from the ray gun as images on the 3rd floor show) while the USSR continued teleportation research and attempted to enhance the hybrids by experimenting on monkeys (as well as the Thundergun, indicated by the Russian script on the side.)

6. This was all caused by 935 research being left behind. A small piece of trivia like this lead to all this research! (The butterfly effect in full.)

7. This is the future that the 4 teleported too, the future determined by the past they left, with historical context we can also easily extrapolate this result as Treyarch did to create this story and I have here by comparing the correlation between their work of fiction and history.

8. Therefore, and I can't stress this enough, this alternate past, is an alternate past! When they teleported to their future/our nearer past, they didn't! Their future and our past are two seperate entities, time is not a line, as many stories and theorists have claimed, it is a web.

9. Remeber the oscilating universe theory? Well it is easier to understand as I have said earlier, as scenarios rather than universes, this future they have arrived in is different to our past as the past events were different, creating a different scenario. So instead of their future = our past, their in an alternate future/an alternate past for us.

10. This past was further differentiated from ours as they made more and more decisions, look back at the web idea, if they keep going off on a tangent, they'll end up on the opposite side of the page to our history! And they did, I don't recall the Earth being bombed from space, do you?

11. Therefore there is only one logical conclusion to this question; how do they return to our historic web-timeline and escape this 115 orientated one? The answer is simple. Prevent it.

12. But how to prevent it? Time travel. To prevent this event they must return to, and I emphasise this, AT LEAST before the US and USSR reach the 935 research, obviously they could return after this and still keep us on our historic webline (as after all, any improbability is still a probability) yet it is easier to arrive before this and effectively 'clean up' before the international parents come home.

13. Therefore (don't worry we're nearing the end..) there are as I put in my strip, 4 very realistic points they can return to.

- 1 - Prevent all of this by returning to World War 2, either to:

a. Stop Richtoffen proir to 935 and his interaction with the Vrill-Ya pyramid, preventing his insanity and the discovery of the moon base.

b. Arrive after they teleported away and stop all of this, i.e. through future Sam stopping past sam as they defeated Richtoffen, by

changing the past he ceases to exist as he is trapped in a future which didn't happen, ergo he teleported away from Der Riese into oblivion.

- 2 - Prevent 935 being created and discovering 115. i.e. going prior to IG faben's creation and WW2 to warn Maxis. With this past Sam is saved from

a horrid fate, Maxis can create a new body for her instead of resarching 115 and can give her a home, while she gets her dad back, a very

soppy end to the story!

- 3 - Prevent this by going forward/ or just teleporting to the destroyed Earth, i.e. going forward to when earth has recovered to gain technology

to then go back and prevent this!

- 4 - Go back to Kino! Contradict my borderline and stop Earth being blown up and defeat the zombies, i.e. just like in Der Riese as they return

without Richtoffen they have defeated him, so Sam lets up!

This last one is the cleverist theory as this then leaves 115 research still around leading to all those conspiracy theories in history about 115

being in the island of stability and being used in UFOs.... but more importantly is leaves the possibility for future games of zombies set in the

present!

All of these theories are used just for the epilogue of my comic based on Zombies, to leave with the words; 'Whatever the reason we are still here, I have no doubt the 4's story is not yet over...'

Yet they also lead to possibly ways Treyarch could continue the story... If you're playing Bo2 and this is what happens... well. :shock:

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Guest Shoreyo   
Guest Shoreyo

Edit (if I edit the first post a moderator has to approve the whole post again)

Just forgot to mention why the answer has to be time travel.

As our 60s history and the characters 60s is in a different web of time the only way to return to our web is to backtrack to the point where the two timelines differentiated, imagine it as a maze, they are stuck in a path, to get to the right path they have to retrace their footsteps to a point where the paths forked. In this case as I have explained, the path splits in '45 when they teleport, as they leave behind research which leads to the US/USSR's work on 115 but more importantly they didn't stop Sam!

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Guest aegisknight   
Guest aegisknight

I think a better explanation is that the earth simply wasn't destroyed at the end of the easter egg

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Guest Shoreyo   
Guest Shoreyo

I think a better explanation is that the earth simply wasn't destroyed at the end of the easter egg

But it wasn't! I keep telling you :D But they need to revert to the present timeline and to do that they need to return to the crossing point, ergo 1945

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Guest aegisknight   
Guest aegisknight

its possible, but your twisted timeline is I feel is so much more complicated than it needs to be. Honestly it was far too vague to make any reliable conclusions, so we'll probably need to just wait for the next game

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Guest Shoreyo   
Guest Shoreyo

its possible, but your twisted timeline is I feel is so much more complicated than it needs to be. Honestly it was far too vague to make any reliable conclusions, so we'll probably need to just wait for the next game

Complicated? This is nothing :D But you've hit it on the head there! We just need to wait and see...

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Guest BlindBusDrivr   
Guest BlindBusDrivr

But we don't know for sure when Moon happened, for all we know it could have been years in the future.

We know the vril ya tele porters can travel through time.

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Guest Shoreyo   
Guest Shoreyo

@Bus driver, Good point :P but if the events of moon were in the future/present it would not change the final outcome :) But remember as far as we don't know if the characters teleport to area 51 or travel from Shangri-La.

And also remeber that the only confirmed time travel was caused by the wunderwaffe hitting the teleporter. This hasn't happened since as far as we know.

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Guest BlindBusDrivr   
Guest BlindBusDrivr

@Bus driver, Good point :P but if the events of moon were in the future/present it would not change the final outcome :) But remember as far as we don't know if the characters teleport to area 51 or travel from Shangri-La.

And also remeber that the only confirmed time travel was caused by the wunderwaffe hitting the teleporter. This hasn't happened since as far as we know.

Kino to ascension is time travel Kino must be between 65'-69' and ascension was in 1962. same time as five, cuban missile crisis.

But one more thing, if satan planned the destruction of the world with the nukes, and the world is supposedly going to end in december 21, 2012, what if they are implying that as the date of moon?

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Guest Undead xP   
Guest Undead xP

Hmm... This reminds me of Apollo 18. It could be possible that things went to hell in a hand basket back in the 60's at the moon as the base was eventually overwhelmed. And I say that because the technology and equipment dates back during missile crisis and all. There would be a distinct difference had the 4 actually teleported near our present time. But the thing is, even earth is set in the 60's with all the equipment left behind at Area 51....

So that would mean the world was pretty much overwhelmed sometime during the 60's So it can't be close to 2012. However, the idea of world ending by nuclear war is definitely being implied.

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Guest Shoreyo   
Guest Shoreyo

@Bus driver, Good point :P but if the events of moon were in the future/present it would not change the final outcome :) But remember as far as we don't know if the characters teleport to area 51 or travel from Shangri-La.

And also remeber that the only confirmed time travel was caused by the wunderwaffe hitting the teleporter. This hasn't happened since as far as we know.

Kino to ascension is time travel Kino must be between 65'-69' and ascension was in 1962. same time as five, cuban missile crisis.

But one more thing, if satan planned the destruction of the world with the nukes, and the world is supposedly going to end in december 21, 2012, what if they are implying that as the date of moon?

Must have missed that thing about 2012, I know Assassin's creed did something on that, but wjhere does it say that in Zombies? Not disregarding your theory I just haven't seen that post or evidence yet :D

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Guest football5699   
Guest football5699

If you want to consider the brand of radio in S-L then the events of DAYTIME S-L happened in 2004-now. The question is, do they go forwards towards 2012 or backwards. Well wait, isn't Maxis trying to undo something with the nukes? If so then I'm guessing he wants to erase zombies completely.

Wow I just got a crazy, not likely thought. What if NML isn't the same day as Moon? How do we know we are teleporting to the same day. I GUESS seeing the nukes explode in A51 COULD disprove it OR 3arc wanted a kick ass easter egg for people to see.

For all we know, the teleporters in Moon/NML are unstable and are just spitten u out in different years although now that I say that it is highly unlikely and has NO evidence lol. uhhhhhh nvm.

I feel like we may be overlooking NML to an extent, though. We know too little about the setting and time about both NML and Moon.

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